Behind Our Eyes Book Launch
Author Kevin Hubschman Interviewed by Ann Chiappetta
February 10, 2025

Ann Chiappetta: Good evening, everyone. Welcome to the February 10th Behind Our Eyes book launch, I'm your host, Anni Chiappteta. And tonight we have our guest author, Kevin Hubschman. Before we get to Kevin, I'm going to uh tell you a little bit about him first.

Ann: Kevin Hubschman lives in the Carolinas with his wife, Trish Hubschman, the author of the Tracy Gayle series and other books and their dog, Henry. Kevin says he's battling a variety of issues, including chronic kidney disease. And it's taking things day by day. We're thinking about you, Kevin.

Ann: Kevin is also the author of a collection of songs and poems called Outside the Circle, and that's available on Amazon. This is Kevin's first novel with a follow-up planned featuring Ken Halsey's continuing story in the works.

Ann: One More Reason to Cry, Kevin's book, is the first part of a two-part novel, The Life of Ken Halsey. It's a roller coaster ride of Ken's many mishaps and few triumphs.

Ann: Part one chronicles Ken's first three decades of life from the 1960s to the mid-1980s. So let's follow Ken and pick up that book and read it.

Ann: So Ken Halsey's story begins in Sheepshead Bay, Brooklyn to his rocky school years to the early beginning of his working life. And don't forget, watch out for that second novel after you read the first one.

Ann: And I think that might be called Ken Halsey's Next Years or possibly even may have a new title. I don't know. We'll check in with Kevin. And the DLD website to Kevin's book is www.dldbooks.com slash Kevin Hubschman. And it's K E V I N.H-u-b-s-c-h-n-a-n. All right. Welcome, Kevin. How are you?

Kevin: Hi, how are you?

Ann: I'm good. So…I already said some stuff about you, but probably not enough. So we're going to continue the questions. So what made you write this book?

Kevin: Well, I guess it would be the male equivalent of a diary or a journal that I kind of kept mostly in my head more than on paper throughout all of the years.

And then different revelations come to you later in life when you realize things that you you know maybe had percepted before and The thing is the trick is to get everything down on paper. But as I've said, in the midst of time, and for the purposes of fictionalizing things,  get kind of a twist it around a little bit.

Ann: Yeah, I understand that. One of my novels is based a lot on what what went on in my personal life You know, sometimes I believe what i wrote That didn't really happen. I don't know. We tend to believe our stories, right?

Kevin: Well, it's a blurred line in a lot of instances.

Ann: Hmm. So who helped you write this book in terms of getting it formatted and stuff like that. Was it DLD Books?

Kevin: Yeah, I didn't need any…proofreading or editing or anything like that because i was a sort of an English teacher, I hadn't it, internship and he did some substitute teaching for middle school english So I don't have much trouble in that department. As far as the formatting, yeah, it was David at DLD Books. I still owe money to them.

Ann: You shouldn't be admitting that. I don't know. Who helped you with the cover? Did you make the cover or did David?

Kevin: I had originally called the book something else. It was called Growi’n Up, G-R-O-W plus apostrophe N. And I had come up with a cover. There was sort of a timeline From the silhouette of a baby to a person in their 60s. I just ultimately did not like the cover all the title. So I took the same book and I refiled it One More Reason to Cry. And since it's sort of a comedy and a tragedy. I came up with the cover of the classic masks Theater menace for comedy and tragedy. Yeah, that was all my idea.

Ann: Okay. And then David helped you make it into a cover?

Kevin: Yeah, no, I…Well, it sounds like it was meant to be then, then you know? Yeah, that's the only thing I can't do is the formatting you know they put Yeah, it was great to see it finally Because I've had all these pages you know in these loose leaf ponders for so long as long as I can remember. They've managed to survive, moving from three different houses. So it was a relief to be able to get it in a copy that I can have on my bookshelf

Ann: Yeah, I know I've lost some of my own diaries and I can kick myself for losing them, I probably, probably should have kept closer touch with them, but oh, well, things happen, right?

Kevin: Yeah, I think more people should, you know, because I talked to some people and a lot of people have interesting stories about their lives and Even David's wife at DLD, she's had a pretty interesting life. And people are admitted to the senior center one of the couples there actually wrote a book about the time they spent his 50th wedding anniversary. and Alaska and it was great. It was funny, it was. So I think a lot of people have stories to tell. But they're afraid because they might not know how to write. Well, they might not know how to spell, But, you know, I just took a shot at it. I'm not a professional writer.

Ann: Yeah, I think it's a great thing to undertake, especially about that couple with their 50th wedding anniversary memories. That's beautiful I just read a thing from this book promoter. His name is Chad Allen. And he said that like millions of people indicate that they want to write a book, but only three per cent of those millions actually write one. 

Kevin: Well, to get it actually read, that's the trick. 

Ann: Only three per cent. That's that's like… but to write it, like people say they want to write a book But yet, you know, people don't pursue it. As much as they think they might want to do. I mean, so much easier Nowadays, too, you know, being an independently published writer is uh you know it's it's something that's something isn't as intimidating as it used to be.

Kevin: It's hard to get any feedback either. I mean, I know that some people have bought my book and some people have read it but I don't get any feedback on it. I don't care if you hate it. But I'm not getting any reactions. Leads me to believe, did these people even buy the book? Did they read it? You know, because I could use the feedback.

Ann: Well, that's a good call to action here on this list. If anybody has read Kevin's book on Amazon or Kindle, please put your, you know, write a little review and put it in there. It's really going to help him.

Kevin: Yeah.

Ann: I know, Kevin, I struggle with those review things too. You know, I try to do my best as a person who reads to review people's books from Amazon and Kindle. And I do most of the time. I haven't done yours yet. I don't know why, but I will do it. I will get to it for sure.

Kevin: I used to be sort of like a semi-professional reviewer, but it was more for music and CDs and live shows.

Ann: Yeah.

Kevin: Because I had a friend in Alamo Island that was that owned Good Times magazine which was a free publication they had everywhere supermarkets and record stores.

Ann: Yeah, I remember that.

Kevin: So I went in there because the guy owed the I worked for the civil service at the time. And I had to go there frequently because the guy owed us a lot of money. And I said, well, can you let me do a little reviewing?

Kevin: And he said, you take one of these CDs and let's see what you can do and I have quite a few back issues here that and the reviews printed and printed

Ann: Yeah. Oh, that's cool. Do you read them again? Like, do you read what you wrote? Like do you ever go back and I call it ego scanning because I do that too. I ego scan my own stuff.

Kevin: Yeah. One of them they have the cover story on. So I framed that one.

Ann: Oh, that's cool. That's cool. Yeah. That’s neat. So, the genre of your book is, I mean, what I would consider literary fiction and you how would you, I mean, how would you describe your readership, their age and their preferences in genre i mean Do you want young kids to read this, teens, older kids? How would you…

Kevin: It depends on your level of, I guess, shock and how you've been brought up, if you've been brought up you know puritanically Yeah, you're not going to like the book. Probably brought up in the 60s and on. You know you probably uh understand a lot of the points to it but points to I would say teens from today They're always eager to… find out what happened in the past and Things that don't exist anymore. So that's kind of a help for them too.

Ann: Okay, great. Do you want to read any of your poetry or lyrics? Or…

Kevin: Oh. Let's see. Poems are fairly short, so I guess that's best. 

Ann: Yeah, read a couple. So the book is Outside the Circle for our listeners. And it's on Amazon and Kindle.

Kevin: A lot of these originally were songs So they don't translate as well to the spoken without the music but I’ll try to find one.

Ann: Okay.

Kevin: Here's a short one. It's called Fall, F A L  L.

During breaks and one of the few times I see it. 
Couldn't sleep last night. 
Emotional thoughts can drive always sleep spirits.
Like a limo lost in the Manhattan tunnel. God, she knows I'm out here trying to get in.

I only want to know just what the hell I did.
It seems to me I'm wrong whatever I may say or do.
I guess I just don't understand love. Do you? Open the window onto cold November.
Another Thanksgiving come and go.

Ann: Wow. I like that image of the limo slipping into the tunnel.

Kevin: Probably during one of our many fights. That's pretty cool.

Ann: Ah, ha, ha, ha, as long as you don't go to bed angry, right? Is that what people say?

Kevin: Yeah, well, things have improved a lot over the years. I mean. Back in the beginning. Yeah, a lot of problems. I think moving away was the best thing we did.

Ann: Yeah. Well, marriage is, you know, it's not something that you, you know, pop into the microwave and it comes out cooked you know you got a lot there's a lot of things you have to work on together And you both got to cooperate. So I think every sustainable couple, you know, you've been whether it's 20 years or 30 years or even 10 years, you know, you go back you think about what it was like when you first became a couple and it's like, oh my goodness, we got past those things. So, yeah. All right. Well, back to the book. So how long did it take to actually write the book?

Kevin: Well, it was already compiled into These loose leaflets All I had to do was really polish it up. [Henry snarls] Henry! So, you know, just… Just getting off my rear and just saying now I'm going to really do it. So it wasn't, I mean, I could say it's a labor of over 40 years or so You know, to actually get it published, pretty fast process.

Ann: Hmm. So you had to type it from handwritten binder paper, that kind of thing?

Kevin: No, I was always good with that stuff. So when I was even when I was very young, I had a typewriter. So I just type that I type my school assignments and But I do have good handwriting, so I got that from my father.

Ann: Oh, all right.

Kevin: Yeah.

Ann: Lucky you. I don't even, I don't, you know, I think kids barely get any cursive handwriting instruction anymore. I find that bizarre. Yeah, I don't know what…people are going to do because there's still a lot of things that are in cursive. Yeah, still have to know how to write your name.

Kevin: Yeah, at least keeping that.

Ann: So thinking about the book, there was a lot of tough parts of this book. Some gritty stuff going on. Did you struggle with any… parts of this book in terms of toning it down you know or um you know thinking about, well, maybe I shouldn't include that or anything like that.

Kevin: Well, that's just not the kind of person I am, which I guess explains the reason that I am a bit off-putting to a lot of people and don't have any friends or my family either. But I have to just felt like it is. I don't think it should be sugarcoated at all. I want people to know that This is… a version of reality And one of the goals is to have somebody look at that and say to themselves well after all he's gone through well he should really be dead. And he's still going. So whatever problems I have can probably be worked through as well.

Ann: Great perspective to have. I, you know, personally, I think your book was really intense and there was sad parts to it. And full of experiences. You know that I identified with because we grew up around the same time. You know? And, you know, just there were so many decisions affecting the main character you know that were really difficult for all of these actually your experiences? Or did you add or delete anything or you know, change stuff around a lot.

Kevin: It's based on a lot of what I can recollect, my memory's not Great. Think I was a character and myself. Products of their environment. Brooklyn was a good place for Ken. And it was a good place for me. And to be ripped out of there because my parents were afraid things were going to start getting worse in the city. And move us to Long Island where right from day one, I felt like i didn't fit in there. And um so. Also, the schools I went to on Long Island. I mean, they were most of the kids in school were into drugs and drinking and that's the kind of school it was and that's the kind of people i encountered. As far as making friends, I didn't have a a lot of options there and you kind of get sucked into everything like that. And you just try to keep above it all like no matter what You'll see in the book no matter what happens to Kenny. He always maintains some semblance of self-control. He never loses himself He's never in any like really critical danger of doing something so reckless that would cost him his life. Yeah, that's true.

Ann: Self-preservation, right?

Kevin: Yeah.

Ann: Do you think that's something that's learned or something that you're born with or a little bit of both?

Kevin: I don't think you can learn it or be born with it. I think it's just…a matter of what needs to be done. I always do what I have to do. And one of my poems i Reflecting on their name. My line is I can handle it. I've always handled it. And so…you know, well, I like being having all this responsibility, not having many people I can talk with or discuss anything or people that are even sympathetic to my problems. No, but I mean, this is the…you have the cards that you're dealt and you can either play them or you can give up.

Ann: Yeah. So let's talk about some of the other characters in the book. How well did you remember or misremember them, in your opinion?

Kevin: Well, I had a kind of stylized version of my mother in the book and it wasn't until After I finished it until after on my 60th birthday when she never called me and I started to realize that she had dementia and then she had…It's been three years now. Since I've heard anything from her um I can't call her because… She has around the clock care. And the aides will just hang the phone up on me.

Kevin: And so I don't know what's going on with But in the book in the book You know, we have a pretty close relationship My second book, not going to be as kind to her as the first one was.

Kevin: My father, he was a very good guy but he worked all the time six days a week and he kind of just left the job of parenting both mother and father. To my mother and my mother she was kind of emotionally abusive. A little bit physically, but mostly emotional. So that really took a toll on me.

Ann: What does your family think about the book?

Kevin: Well, my family to speak of as it is consists of my younger brother who hasn't spoken to me for over 20 years. So I very much doubt that he even is aware that there is a book out. And my mother… has not picked up a book a magazine She gave everything up. She basically just watches TV all day long every single day. So, to really worry about that. My mother-in-law did read the books. She's going to be 90 this November. And she thought it was a bit shocking but it was well written and it kept her you know attention and she's a very avid reader.

Ann: Oh, that's great. I know when we were talking before, you mentioned your seniors’ group. Have any of them read the book?

Kevin: You know, there's one guy I gave a copy of the book to uh. He's 94 and um doesn't say much about it. He didn't criticize it either i mean He said he read it and for me For a guy like him, you know, that's all i could really expect. The other people seem, and this is kind of an ongoing thing with the seniors group, is a very, I wouldn't say puritanical, but very devoted to religion It's a fine line to have a county run organization like a seniors group where people you know it doesn't, shouldn't matter if you're a Christian, Jewish, and there's many different types of Christians, you know, Christians and even people that don't believe in God everybody should be welcome and accepted there. But there are people there that kind of they're like zealous and they kind of proselytize all the time and I find that very disconcerting And I can't enjoy myself at a place like that. So I'm trying to get the county to realize that there needs to be some kind of a separation. because living here in the Carolinas there are certainly you know there’s like a place of worship on every corner practically, so you don't…

Ann: You know what they call the South, the Bible Belt. 

Kevin: Right.

Ann: We're right at the beginning of like the Midwest and like living in Pennsylvania It's, it's… kind of like that here, but I can see where you know, if you don't have your choices. And you have, you know, having closed-mindedness can affect any group of people.

Kevin: Yeah, it's a violation of law too. In fact, it doesn't matter what state you're in.

Ann: So, yeah, I try to keep my mind open and You know, let everybody pick or choose as they see fit, but it's hard in groups like that. I guess they get to, you know. to a certain level of comfort you know or like-mindedness and they just, you know, it just kind of builds on itself. Yeah.

Kevin: Yeah. Right. But everything you do to stand up for yourself comes at a price because you're not going to make many fans by being the bad guy and it seems like I'm always the one nobody else will say anything and I'm the one that has to do it. because I generally don't like to sit back and take things. I reached a lot of problems.

Ann: Yeah.

Kevin: It leads to anonymity.

Ann: Right, wow. So we're just about at 730. And we can start taking some questions. 

Kevin: All right. 

Ann: Let me get over to the right window. We're such an intimate group here. I think if you just unmute yourself and say your name and ask your question, that'll be fine. I don't think we have to do the hand raising thing. So if anybody has a question for Kevin, just unmute and speak up. Anybody?

Lisa Busch: Hi, this is Lisa. I was wondering how long the book is. 

Kevin: Let me just take a quick look. Three hundred and… twenty-eight pages.

Ann: Could you repeat that, Kevin? Thank you.

Kevin: 328. 

Ann: Thank you.

Kevin: If you look at my loose leaf, all the pages I have in there. It's like 700 or 800. So I said, even if I edit this and condense it down. It has to be two books.

Ann: Oh, wow. Yeah. So your other book will be about the same amount in pages?

Kevin: Yeah, hopefully if I can get it tailored down. I have… Really not as far as editing that book yet. It's tentatively titled already it's going to what would be called the absence of presence And that kind of fits my situation very well. And the cover is going to be generated by artificial intelligence. I already have some ideas for that.

Ann: It sounds like the AI got released just in time for a lot of people to use it for their book covers and I personally, I have a lot of fun with it.

Kevin: Yeah.

Ann: I mean, I know, I know, you know, that there are bad apples and they take advantage but I mean, if you use it responsibly. There's no reason to not use it if you use it responsibly, right? I think it's…Think of it like driving a car. You got to be responsible and know how to use it and know the rules and then, you know, you're okay.

Kevin: Yeah, I think it'll help. Like you said, a lot of people that always wanted to write their stories it'll help them really get that out. Because it'll be such a major tool for writing and music too. Practically anything you can think of science and I'm praying that i'm praying they come up with something that will help me live with kidney disease for a very long time. I just read where a 66 year-old man Just got a pig kidney transplant and he said he feels great who's off dialysis. So hopefully the longer I can stave it off, the better the technology will be.

Ann: Yeah, it's interesting. Going back to that thing about A.I. I mean, I, I…do a lot of volunteer stuff and I'm the President of Friends in Art and all that. And I wanted to write a fundraising letter, and I went to Chat GBT and put in my string of terms and it came out with a beautiful letter and I just, you know, it was great. It hit all the points and it organized it well. And I went in and edited it and added little you know things personalizing it a little bit, but pretty much that AI took an hour's worth of work from me and gave me back an hour. So I value it for the time piece, you know, and the ability to organize things, you know, when you get stuck. I was stuck. I wasn't sure what I wanted to say or how I wanted to say it. And I thought it was great. 

29:12
Kevin: Yeah. You know, cut down on a lot of research for those kind of books. Like historical fiction where you need to know, need to be a little accurate with things.

Ann: Yeah.

Kevin: And so you won't have to you know that's probably a drudgery part of writing that kind of book is the research. I always hated doing research for doing college papers and then this and then and so it's would have been great back then.

Ann: Yeah, where did you go to school? I don't think we covered that in the beginning.

Kevin: Did my first semester, I wanted to go away to school. When they wanted to major in accounting because my father was a CPA. So my guidance counselor suggested they go to bloomsburg state college in pennsylvania which is now called Bloomsburg University.

Ann: Right.

Kevin: It is so close to Scranton, Hazleton area. And it was another one of those situations where It was kind of a party school and they didn't get much done. And just living away was kind of traumatizing me. Because I was always taken care of and And I was always food on the table and this and that to work. So it really affected my grades there. So I started applying to more local schools on Long Island. I applied the half straw. I didn't get in there. And I got into Adelphi. And that's where I ended up going to and graduating from.

Ann: Okay.

Kevin: With the bachelor's in English and a minor in education.

Ann: Why'd you pick education?

Kevin: I always… Story, what can I do that I'm good at? Always good at english I always got A's on my writing papers in college i took in college advanced writing courses when I was a freshman i took a course that was only for seniors There's an excerpt in the book that's based on that incident. Where I wrote a story. It so impressed me.

Ann: Right. I remember that. Yes.

Kevin: So then he let me into it. Level class when I was a freshman.

Ann: Right. So there was a prerequisite, but you managed to impress the professor, so he waived that. o get into that class in the book.

Kevin: And I figured, you know, English would be good. I think the mistake I made was not going for a more diverse like a grade school type of situation where you're just dealing with one group of kids and you get used to that Becomes a little more route, whereas my internship and student teaching experiences The kids were very… unruly and they don't respect you when you're just there as a substitute or as an intern. And it kind of soured me on the whole thing. Also the fact that I had applied to every school district on Long Island and couldn't even get a single interview So that kind of dashed my hopes a bit.

Ann: So what did you do?

Kevin: Well, my father started bringing home a civil service newspaper with State, county, and federal exams that you can take to get jobs.

Ann: Yes.

Kevin: So I started taking exams I took one for a tax compliance representative at the New York State Department of Taxation and Finance.

Ann: Nice. Got the job. Went for the interview.

Kevin: At the World Trade Center. I had my choice of working there. Working in Brooklyn on Flatbush Avenue when i I chose Brooklyn. I wouldn't i wouldn't have affected me as far as 9-11 because By that time, the tax department was out of that building. But still, it's something to reflect on. And so I worked in Brooklyn for I started in 1985.

Ann: Right.

Kevin: I spent two years out of college Piling the payment, going to Manhattan every day. Looking for a job, going on interviews so i couldn't get anything. I really wanted to do something with proofreading, copy editing.

Ann: Yeah.

Kevin: Something like that, but I couldn't break into that it was very tough and After that, I took the test and got the job and I started going to Brooklyn every day which was kind of a drag me. Came up at five o'clock in the morning. And you've got to get up on that freezing cold train platform Yeah, I know.

Ann: Oh, so you worked. You commuted. How long was the commute?

Kevin: It was about 45 minutes. Once you got to the station. The subways and buses were so overcrowded that it was fast that actually walked down to where the building was so that took another 15 or 20 minutes. And then you would leave the building in the wintertime and it was pitch dark. My neighborhood was not great. So it's a little scary.

Ann: Hmm.

Kevin: And I did that until 1988. Well, I transferred to tax department in Hempstead, Long Island closer to home, right? Yeah. I know it was much better because I was much closer Yeah, and also Chris was working in Hempstead also. At that time for um the state insurance fund which was practically around the corner from where I was working. And at that time she was a lot more independent. She could take buses and things like that, walk a lot, you know. Me.

Ann: How did you guys meet?

Kevin: I put the ads on the Newsday newspaper all the Island.

Ann: Yeah?

Kevin: The personals. Went on quite a few dates before I think her mother pressured her to get out of the house answer some of the ads. So that's what happened.

Ann: Wow, personal ad, huh? Wow.

Kevin: Yeah and i think I write something about some of those dates in the book that really went awry. Okay, could be in the first book. I'm not sure.

Ann: What, in the second book? Or…

Kevin: It probably is. This is the second.

Ann: I don't remember that, but you could be misremembering. I know there were some dates, I think, but…

Kevin: Right. The second book focuses more on the period after i after

Ann: Right. Well, you're going to have to get that book written, Kevin, because now I'm

Kevin: It's written. I just… have to catch up financially with the publishers because now I have to pay for her book.  And she wants to also put out a book later on with all those dog stories you know child to mom.

Ann: Yeah, Henry's stories.

Kevin: It could be one of these situations where you don't like the first book But the second book kind of makes you like the first book because the second book is more relatable to you personally.

Ann: Right.

Kevin: That's the kind of thing that could happen. Because it's a lot less.

Ann: Yeah.

Kevin: Gritty and still captivating you know it shows the maturity

Ann: Yeah, yeah. You also have a context, a backstory you might not have. You know, if you didn't read the first book into the second book. Right. You know, that's It's kind of funny, like when I read authors who um have a series they they have to lean into the backstory of the first book In the second book, and I get impatient with that sometimes. I'm like, oh, I already read the first book. I don't want to read over, but they feel obligated to do that because they don't want readers to feel Like they'd gotten dropped in the middle of nowhere. I get that. But sometimes I find it almost too much you know especially if I'm reading you know a three series book, you know, books that are three, like three books and I'm going to read them right after the other. Why would I need all that backstory? You know, like I already read the backstory. So I don't know. That's just me.

Kevin: Well, I kind of addressed that right at the beginning so from page one, you can see that it's kind of the whole thing's kind of like a flashback So, you know, I'm not going to have a flashback on the flashback so

Ann: Right, right. Yeah. Right. That's what I mean, sort of being dealt with. Anybody else have questions for Kevin? All right, Marlene, go for it.

Marlene Mesot: This is Marlene. I do. 

Ann: Alright, Marlene. Go for it. 

Marlene; Is there a correlation between music and writing for you?

Kevin: Well, definitely with the book of poetry and songs. When I was younger. I bought a You call it a four-trak. It looks like a cassette recorder But you can record two tracks like say drums and guitar on one side flip the tape over and you can record any kind of other instruments and vocals On the other side. So I started writing songs basically in college, he took a lot of these boring four-hour classes. And the rules were very loose at that time you could sit in the back of the classroom. Smoke your pipe or your cigarettes You know, and just drift off because things got boring. So I wrote a lot of songs that way and poems. And when I was working I used to write some of my poems on the bathroom wall and didn't really appreciate that too much.
Kevin: But yeah, it does kind of one thing kind of leads into the other and my book does my book does mention a lot of scenarios. About concerts and music and things and and playing in bins and playing in bins my brother now being in beds with me and things like that. So… Music is a huge part of my life. Where most people you know keep statistics about sports and players and things like that. I know a great deal about music from especially from the 60s to the 80s and i try to keep up on what's going on today. That doesn't particularly interest me that much. But yeah, it's all related.

Ann: Cool. Have you written actually any songs? With music, music scores or guitar, piano

Kevin: Yeah. Yeah, I don't play instruments very well. Back when I was younger. 1989, I had a friend that could play any instrument. So he did a lot of the tracks So I do have them on mp3 files. People have heard them. They like them. Some people say, well, I can't believe that's you. Because I'm so sure I could never just so like right now just start singing You know, but… It was, you know. I tried to get some more people involved. It's very tough. You really have to come into this with a couple of friends already to just try to get strangers together to to do music is very tough. I like it. So…

Ann: Yeah. That's true. There's a level of trust and And just a whole bunch of other types of dynamics that go on in that kind of like a musical band or a group or a chorus or whatever Got to work together and get to know each other and Yeah.

Kevin: Yeah. I have songs that I think are good enough that if Somebody how famous could at least listen to them. They might be interested, but you know that is practically impossible to make something like that happen.

Lisa: If you have, this is Lisa again. If you have mp3 files, could you put them on YouTube or somewhere?

Kevin: I don't know. I'm not very technical. I did have some of the songs were a website, but I'd have to go back and see what the name of the website was. If I can remember that. I'll post something on Facebook where I'll tell Trish to tell people about it.

Ann; Yeah. Yeah.

Kevin: And the friend they had it. They helped me with the songs. He said to me, he had the opposite problem as me. I had a bunch of lyrics and words and they couldn't put the music And he had a bunch of music that he couldn't figure out he says like every one of his lyrics sounded stupid he couldn't really do it. So he gave me a bunch of instrumental music And I turn those into songs too i put words to his music so i have some of those recordings as well

Ann: Oh, that's who you want to try to find the person that has the music but needs the words. That's what I need. I need a person who who wants to write the music to my words because I kind of know like

Kevin: Like I get an idea in my head, you know, like I know what a song could, but I have no idea how to write a song. I write the words, not the songs. So.

Kevin: That's kind of what I do with Trish's stories. I have the good ideas I'm like, I could never turn this into a book. So I give her the ideas and she does them.

Ann: All right. So let's see. So we're at 7:45. Does anybody have any other questions for Kevin?

Abbie Taylor: Yes, Kevin, this is Abbie. And just for those of you, in case there's anybody here who isn't familiar with Trish's Tracy Gayle series. She writes these books about this detective, a private eye, Tracy Gayle, who is married to heartthrob rock singer Danny Tide.who has his own band, Tidalwave, and so, Kevin, I’m just wondering if you've ever thought about writing a song or two that Danny Tide might write or sing and somehow that somehow Trish could incorporate into one into a Tracy Gayle Mystery. I'm not sure how that would work, but the idea just kind of came into my head and I'm just wondering if you ever thought about it.

Kevin: I believe she did do that once. I think I had a song called Party. And she did use that in, I don't know if the book was I think it was one of the more recent books I'm pretty sure she did. Did just that.

Ann; Oh, that's cool.

Abbie: Okay, I just don't remember seeing the lyrics, but maybe I just maybe misremembering,the damn thing. So that's great.

Kevin: She takes a lot of my ideas and runs with them.

Abbie: That's great.

Kevin: Let me try.

Abbie: Yeah, that's great.

Kevin: You know, I'm having trouble thinking of what I can do next. And I tell her about ideas and a lot of stuff comes from dreams I have and things like that.

Ann:Yeah, I think a lot of us get our… that our creative brains work overtime in your dreams and you wake up and you're going, oh, I got to write that down before I forget.

Kevin: It's true. As soon as you wake up, it's gone usually so Why you're dreaming and it just seems So real.

Ann: Yeah.

Lisa: This is Lisa again. What made you think that you wanted to be a writer? I mean, did you have a teacher that inspired you or how did you figure out that you wanted to write?

Kevin: Yeah, when I was in grade school. They didn't have any kind of graduation ceremony They had those autographed books that they passed around.

Lisa: Yeah.

Kevin: And being that I didn't have that many friends. My bookie, I still have it is mostly teachers. Signs it and they all wrote, you know, keep writing You are my best door and you're such a great reader. You know, things like that. That kind of inspired me when I was In the sixth grade to teach First, I volunteered to teach first graders how to read And so… Kind of… got me thinking that, you know, this is something I might want to do.

Ann: Great. Anyone else have questions for Kevin? Lisa, do you want to say anything about Behind Our Eyes for the recording?

Lisa: Well, Behind Our Eyes is an organization for disabled writers and we have many avenues of creativity Which include Sunday night calls where we have speakers or we do critiques. We have a writer's exchange program where people in the organization Present free classes. We have…a magazine, Magnets and Ladders, that comes out twice a year on the web and consists of essays And short stories and poetry. Of course, we have these book launches which we're going to have some more in the future. We, let's see, I'm not as good at talking off the cuff as maybe some people are. So I'm sure I'm forgetting.

Ann: You're doing great.

Lisa: I'm forgetting something. But it's a great organization. I'm glad you all were here.

Ann: Thanks, Lisa. Behind Our Eyes website is www.behindoureyes.org. Kevin, you've got the last word. Anything you want to say before we close out for the evening?

Kevin: Well, I appreciate you all. And like I said, like. Feedback. If you liked it, you hated it, I don't take There's not that many things that I take in life personally. It'll just go with the flow. And if you're interested at all songs and poetry that book is also available So, and… I'm going to try to get that book out. Probably the next book out probably by the end of the year. We'll see how that goes. God willing, they're helpful. Be stable for a good long time. I can continue to take care of myself and take care of Trish and take care of my dog. Yeah. Hey, Patrice.

Patrice: Hi, I want to say something. Hi, my name is Patrice. Hi, I just want to say that I did read the book. I really liked it a lot. It kept my interest It was, I'm going to be honest, it was very heavy. You know, there was a lot of sadness in the book. I was really rooting for Ken and I hope like the second book, there's some more happy moments That for him, you know.

Kevin: Yeah. Yeah, there will be.

Kevin: It's definitely a little rate, not as dramatic. You know, things have not been great in my life, you know, even to this day. But still, you know. With maturity, you know, comes a little more stabilization. And then the realization Especially when you have several major ailments and start to see your own mortality. That really kind of straightens you out.

Ann: Hmm. Yeah, I can totally, that resonates with me. Dealing with life after 60 is definitely, you know, got to be a have a little courage and be brave Because things get complicated.

Kevin: Well, hopefully my goal is to at least live past 65 because That's when my father died in. His family did not have much longevity. 

Ann: Oh, yeah, that's where the generational thing comes in, right? Yeah. Well, all right. So we're going to, I guess we're going to sign off and um Kevin, I want to thank you for coming and sharing so much of your life with us and giving us a little extra tidbit on Trish and Henry. I really appreciate um everything that you do and that Trish does in the writing world and just wish you the best. I can't wait for the next book.

Kevin: Thank you very much. Appreciate it. Thanks for guiding through this.

Ann: All right. I'm going. Yeah, no problem. It was fun. So I'm going to close out the room and everybody have a good evening.

Kevin: You too. Thank you.

Ann: Good night.

Lisa: Good night.